Steering rack on a Toylander 2

[Tore]

Hi folks.

I've decided to install rack-and-pinion steering on the Toylander.

The rack was bought from Desert Design & Fabrication LLC desertkarts.com this summer.  It is an 8" rack meant to be used on desert buggies.  At $89, I think it is good value for the money.  To save a bit, I had it shipped by sea.  It took two months to arrive, and total cost including shipping and tax was NOK 960,- or ?98.



What I've done so far, is to mount the rack under the car.  The easy bit.  As you see from the pictures, it fits nicely.  I had to make a 4mm spacer between the rack housing and the floor to make space for the rubber boots.





I plan to finish the steering during the winter.  There is a few parts I need to fabricate before proceeding work on the car.  I'll keep the stock steering operative as long as possible, the kids really enjoy the Toylander and would be disappointed if I took it out of service for several months. 

I'll report on any progress in this thread, but don't expect very frequent updates...

[colin1117]

Hi all
I'm looking at doing the same ... will be following your thread with interest
Colin

[jimmyybob]

Do you have any updates about the rack yet.?

[max]

As im new to this, forgive me if i sound stupid but with this idea, but will the steering be in the middle of the car?.
Im at the stage where im screwing the batten to the cut out mdf so im a few weeks away from worrying about the "metal" side of things. but im still trying to pre plan so all these photos are great but they are sending my head in to a spin. may be i should stick to the basics!!!!!!
anyway keep up the good work every one!!!
max.

[markh15]

Hi Max,
Ordinarily you'd be right, the rack would be on the same side as the steering wheel.
I am guessing that Tore (a superb engineer) will have some sort of plan in mind to connect the steering shaft to the rack, but he's going to keep us all in suspense for the time being!

the one thing you can be sure of, is that the finished article will not only look fabulous, but work equally as well.

Don't worry so much about complex modifications for the time being, just concentrate on getting the car finished and built to the best (and safest) specification you can, your liile 'un will enjoy it no matter what.
 
The trouble with the forum, is that there are so many innovative and brilliant ideas floating about, that it will make your head spin.
I was lucky, the forum wasn't up and running when I started to build Harvey's car 2 years ago, but that's what winter is for, modifications and upgrades!

Watch this space, as they say!

Keep Busy,
Regards,
Mark.

[Tore]

Hi all.

I told you things would not happen quick around here.  I am not holding you in suspense just to be cruel, though.  I really do not have much time to spend on the Toylander, unfortunately.

That said, I've spent this weekend at my parents house.  The workshop there holds my beloved lathe that I inherited from my father 20-or-so years ago.  So, I've got some things done.  I'll be taking pictures and writing about it in detail when I get home later this week.

When it comes to Mark's advice about building the car, I agree wholeheartedly.  Keep things simple, follow the instructions from Richard.  That way, you get a working car with a minimum of trouble.  *Then* you start modifying, or build a second one :-)

-Tore

[Tore]

Got some photos of the parts I made during the weekend.

First: all the parts, more or less unassembled:

The two aluminum parts will of course be prettified drastically.

The parts that go on the steering column assembled:


The rack with tie rods and sprocket:


As you probably understand, there will be a chain (size #25) connecting the steering column sprocket to the rack.  I would really like to come up with a different way to connect them, but a chain seems to be the simplest.

What happened to "cheap, robust and simple?"...

More info will follow - sometime.

-Tore

[markh15]

Hi Tore,
Nice work so far, I guessed it might be a chain linkng the column and the rack, but I kept my mouth shut (no comment Brian), just incase I was wrong (as usual!!).

As for the 'Cheap, Robust, and Simple' theme, I'm begining to think that this only applies to the builders!!

Keep up the good work. It saves the rest of us mere mortals having too many headaches, when we come to do our cars!!

Keep Busy,
Regards,
Mark.

[brian]

That's a well engineered solution Tore, congratulations.

Regards,

Brian.

[jimmyybob]

Looking good. it does seem a little odd to me to use the chain as i though the idea of a rack was to get rid of the chain.
Could you use two double jointed universal joints instead to make the turn for the column.?

[Tore]

Hi Jimmybob,

The reason for using a rack is to get more turns on the steering wheel from lock to lock, and to make steering less "nervous" when going straight ahead.

I really did want to find a way to avoid using a chain, but all other ideas I've come up with are either very expensive, very complex, weak or a combination of these...  Placing the rack on the side of the car so it would line up with the steering column would be better, but then it would have interfered with the wheel.  Using two universal joints would work, but they would end up where the batteries live...

I am going to steal Brian's idea of placing a double bottom in the battery compartment, hiding the chain more or less completely.  I had actually thought of this before Brian hid his brakes, but no one is going to believe that :-)

Oh, well.  If a better solution turns up, I can always rebuild the steering - again.  And the chain solution seems more promising than I feared.

-Tore

[Robert]

I have allso been strugling with the steering construction and looked at the following possibillities to change the gear ratio:
- a pair of bevel wheels
- chain wheels
- timing pulleys
- 2 hydraulic cilinders (communicating vessels)

In terms of the vailable space , simplicity and costs I choose for chain wheels with a 8/24 ratio.
This construction gives me the same steering angles like the standard axle and a suspension stroke of 18 cm.
Another advantage in my case ,is the fact that the steering is now less heavy because I have quite a lot of weight at the front axle due to the 4 batteries which are placed under the bonnet.

Unfortunately, this construction costs some ground clearance, therefor I will make a guard in front of the axle.

The construction is almost done now, and it looks very promising. Testing is planned for the weekend (IF it ever stops raining   )

[markh15]

Hi Robert,
The problem most of us are fighting with the steering, isn't the way the steering operates (although it is limiting), but the narrow space available under the front wheel-wells.
Others will agree, that if you are using the swing axle as well, this limits lock even more when on uneven ground.

When I constructed the steering box for Harvey's T2, I used gears from 'Technobots' (www.technobots.co.uk), and used a ratio of 3 : 1 as you are planning, with an idler gear to keep the input and output shafts rotating in the same directions.

This works fine, and is very smooth and precise in operation, but because of the wheel arches, the lock is only 3/4 of a turn.

Just thought I'd point this out, before it causes you a headache!!

Keep Busy,
Regards,
Mark.

[Robert]

Hello Mark,

I Knew the problem with limited steering angle by axle inclination, but thanks for your concern! 
But I think that a swing axle is a must for traction AND braking under off road conditions, therefor I accepted this limitation.
I'm still considering the possibility to narrow the section under the bonnet to create more space for the wheels while the axle is inclinated.

anyhow:
I posted my version of changed steering gear ratio because I havn't seen this one at the forum yet, and it's quite easy to fit to the standard steering construction.

[Ron-tje]

Robert,

Is that a hydraulic brake pump I see in your render?


Tore,

What is the ratio of the standard steering rack lock to lock without you r new chain system?
Thanks.